Regarding my previous post

I have learned something profound in the last six hours. That an internet audience is extremely hard to please at all times. I am also learning the boundaries which exist between people from different backgrounds. I must admit that if I were not the Jew I am now, I most probably would be offended by my last posting. That being said, I am not feeling very happy about the outcome of my writings.

I don’t know why Arutz Sheva {IsraelNationalNews} published that article at this particular time. I read their Rabbis every day and study the weekly Parsha in light of Israel politics on their site. Yesterdays encounter on JTF combined with reading this anti-missionary piece on A7 news culminated in my wanting to bring light onto this subject. It has caused me much pain in the long run. What I wrote may have lost me a good number of readers who had come to my site for the reason of discussing the problems at LGF which I share with them. Honestly, this was not my intention.

I am motivated to write only what I feel Hashem places into my hands and mind. Life is a learning experience and it is not supposed to be easy. I spend a good amount of time battling the Nazi and Islamic anti-semitic ideals in cyberspace. Sometimes I worry that our enemies may be looking for me personally {Don’t worry mom!}. I do not fear them, as I believe my date with destiny will come when it will. I often say that I try to learn the wisdom from Pirkie Avos of “Be like Aaron, a man of peace. Seek peace and pursue it”.

One of the paradoxes in this world is that every thing has an equal but opposite factor. The fact that one strives for peace will inevitably cause one to enter into a situation where force is the only way out. Peace doesnt always mean doing things which please everyone. All a Jew needs to do is read last weekends Parsha of Pinchas to learn that the man of peace needs to rise to the occasion when it is needed. A similar Jewish kabbalistic concept is that the middah of Chesed must be tempered by the middah of Gevurah. In english this means that the trait of Kindness & Mercy must be tempered with Strength & Restriction.

As a human being I know that the people of the whole world are made in Hashems own image. We are all his creation. Adam was neither Jew or Gentile, he was Adam HaRishon. He was the first human made with the same strengths and weaknesses you and I have. When one reads the story of Bereshit does anyone think for a second they would not have eaten from the forbidden tree?

What I learned is that I need to consider who I am talking to before I say what I want. The power of speech, which the Jew believes is the most powerful instrument G-d gave to his creations, is potentially a dangerous weapon. It was wrong for me to post this in a forum which is read by a mixed community.

Anyone reading this who thinks I should remove it please send your comments.

Thank you,


PS: A very interesting link about the differences of approaches of Hillel and Shammai @

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5 Responses to Regarding my previous post

  1. V says:

    It’s a somewhat divisive approach (the previous entry). We all know that followers of one faith don’t believe that the followers of another faith are correct. It’s just not always appopriate time or place to point it out or to state it out loud though. If your blog was devoted solely to that, a theological debate, then maybe, but this isn’t really that kind of site. It will probably only upset people.

  2. muman613 says:

    I beg to differ on a number of points, but in the hope of repairing our relations I will defer to another time. I do not seek an argument.


  3. Paul says:

    Hi Muman!

    I do understand this controversy among Jews especially with the Orthodox. I was part of a Messianic Jewish congregation that was Torah observant (they observed the Kashruth dietary laws also) for a season and that helped me tremendously in understanding a little bit about the Jewish mindset. Many Jews think that Messianic Judaism are solely there to missionize the Jews. They do not realize the Messianics reach the goyims and teach Judaism to them! Teaching about Sabbaths, the Kosher laws (thanks to them, I accepted the kosher law and I do not eat pork, shrimp, crabs or any unclean foods and not even catfish! You should see me asking waiter if the fish has scales..LOL). These goyims appreciate Judaism even more so because of that. Then they get to see the Brit Chadasha (the second half of the Christian Bible) in Jewish worldview, as it should be viewed in that way as they were written solely by Jews!

    Many Jews cite the Second Commandment about images…they are right. I do not have any images in my house. I grew up Catholic and so you can see that was quite a 180 degrees change! My mom died last December and one of her most precious object is the statue of Virgin Mary. I should have gotten it as I was her favorite son. I was asked if I wanted it. I said NO. I was very uncomfortable in bringing that statue home. I totally respect my mom but I will not break the Commandments regarding this. So, my sister happily took the statue with her.

    If you are with the Messianic Jews, you will see they are very Zionist too. They understand Torah and totally worship and love Hashem. They will not disrespect the Laws.

    The thing that hurts me is when Ultra Orthodox Jews would attempt to hurt the Messianics or disrupt their services. Both are Torah observant Jews and should respect each other. If there was a Torah contest, why should a Messianic be disqualified in participating in it?

    This is quoting from this article:

    “It is important to note that she did not disclose this information herself. In fact, it would never have been an issue except for the sleuthing of Yad L’achim, a very active anti-missionary group in Israel. Since she is Jewish from the perspective of civil and Jewish law, the Education Ministry permitted her to remain in the contest.

    Bat-El Levy did not win the contest. Apparently, she fell behind relatively early on in the event. However, keep in mind that this is a prestigious international contest. The fact that she was a finalist means that she had won and accomplished much already. Not placing in a contest such as this is like not placing after competing the Olympics, or having your Grammy-nominated album not receive the award. It means that she probably knows more about the Bible than any of us. Besides, imagine the intense pressure she must have felt after the news broke…that alone would have been hard to bear.

    The ironic part of all of this controversy is that Yad L’achim and the rabbis who called for a boycott of the competition only accomplished one thing: further publicity for Messianic Judaism. They really came out looking like they were scared of a teenage girl, and they served to increase awareness of the phobia and persecution of Messianic Jews in Israel. Instead of accomplishing their goal of marginalizing Messianic Jews, Yad L’achim and the Chief Rabbinate managed to marginalize themselves. But had the opposition groups left it alone, no one would ever have known that Bat-El was a believer.”


    it hurts me when Jews deny Messianics as being Jews. It is illogical.

    A Jew does not lose Jewishness when he is an atheist (like FinnAgain in LGF)..he is proud reiterating that he is a Jew and atheist…

    And no Jew at LGF has protested against this!!

    But if a Jew is a Messianic…watch out!! He is not longer a Jew!

    Does this make sense to you?

  4. muman613 says:


    I have thought about what you have said and am impressed with your interest in spirituality and Judaism specifically. I don’t think it is right for me to tell you how to have a relationship with the Almighty. But as a Jew who believes in his heritage and Hashems relationship with us it is not possible to reconcile the differences between what Messianics believe and what is Jewish belief in Moshiach.

    Aside from the major problem with images there is also the problem with the fact that their messiah did not accomplish the tasks which the prophets said Moshiach would accomplish. There are many good sites which enumerate the prophecies which speak of Moshiach and explain that the Christian messiah failed every prophecy which would have proved his existence. If Hashem wanted the Jews to believe in Moshiach so badly why didn’t he tell anyone? He did tell us to beware a man who will come and try to lead Jews away from Hashem. This prophecy in Chumash seems to me to talk about the Christian messiah.

    I firmly believe that Moshiach is coming. It is a mitzvah to await Moshiach every day. The redeemer will come and bring a world of peace and filled with the glory of Hashem and his kindness. We most certainly are not in the messianic age as our world is full of war and ungodliness. There is no second coming in Judaism. We have this life to accomplish our goals, and the next life to reap the rewards of our good deeds. When Moshiach comes and ushers in the new age, then we see the resuscitation of the dead. In our belief this is when all the righteous of the world will rise from the graves and resume an eternal physical existence.

    I hope this explains why I dont accept Christians who call themselves messianics as Jews. While it is true that a born Jew may get attracted into a messianic synagogue, they are still halachically Jews. Once a Jew you are considered a Jew even if you sin, and you can repent at any time, even the day you die.

    We are supposed to bring Moshiach into the world through our thoughts and deeds. I will admit it is good that non-Jews learn our ways, but it depends on what they want to do with that knowledge.


    PS: This is an issue with every sect of Judaism which attributes Messianic status to their Rabbis. There have been several times a Jewish sect will arise with a very charismatic and wise Rabbi whom his disciples consider Messiah. Even these sects are met with the same reaction.

  5. Paul says:

    Thanks Muman for the kind reply.

    Your awaiting the Moshiach is the exact same thing the Christians and the Messianic Jews do.

    As you know, the Christians believe in the resurrection of the dead. That was the issue that divided the Pharisees and the Sadducees in the time of Yshua and was described in the Brit Chadasha.

    Have you heard the discussion in some theological circles that Yshua was theologically in line with Rabbi Hillel and that the ‘Pharisees’ described in the Gospels could have been the followers of Rabbi Shimmai? And that the discussions reflected in the Gospels were an account of the dispute between Shimmai and Hillel?

    It was only because of the voice from Heaven after the destruction of the Temple in 70 CE that the House of Shimmai was not longer followed by the Torah observant Jews. Thus we not longer have the dictates from the House of Shimmai…except perhaps what has been recorded in the Gospels!

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